Understanding and Conquering Stress and Anxiety Feat. Danni Synot
It’s often said that stress is just a part of life. While a little bit of eustress—that positive, nervous excitement before a presentation or event—can be motivating, long-term, negative stress is a silent threat, especially for family carers.
When does this normal pressure cross the line into anxiety? Qualified Counselor Danni Synot explains that when stress lasts for more than a few weeks and begins to interfere with your ability to live life normally—to work, to think, or to maintain relationships—it has transitioned into anxiety. Anxiety often involves debilitating panic attacks.
The Four Responses to Fear and Anxiety
When an older Australian or a caregiver experiences an overwhelming sense of threat or lack of control, the body reacts in one of four ways: Fight, Flight, Freeze, or Fawn. Recognizing your default reaction is the first step to managing it:
Fight: Reacting aggressively or arguing back. This isn't true aggression; it's a fear-driven need to fight one's way out of a perceived threat.
Flight: The irresistible urge to run or flee from a situation, such as a crowded room.
Freeze: Becoming physically and mentally stuck—unable to think, move, or focus.
Fawn: This is the 'people-pleasing' response, often seen in carers. It involves submitting to the perceived threat, letting personal needs and boundaries vanish in the service of others. People in this state often won't ask for or accept help, constantly pouring out without being poured into.
Reclaiming Control: The "So What?" and "But What If?" Mindset
Anxiety is fundamentally rooted in the feeling of being out of control, fueled by negative ‘what if’ thoughts ("What if something bad happens?").
To break this cycle, Danni suggests two simple shifts:
Ask “So What?”: When a negative outcome pops up, acknowledge it and ask, "So what if that happens?" Often, writing down the worst-case scenario reveals it’s not as catastrophic as your anxious mind suggests.
Flip the Script with “But What If?”: Instead of dwelling on the negative, flip it to a positive possible outcome. "What if this change leads me to a better opportunity or lets me pursue a long-buried dream?" This simple technique shifts activity from the stress-driven middle brain to the rational frontal lobe.
Listen to the full episode to hear Danni's story of overcoming debilitating anxiety and how you can implement these strategies.
For more resources on carer wellbeing and support, visit Carer Gateway or My Aged Care.
Full Transcription - 11 Understanding and Conquering Stress & Anxiety Feat. Danni Synot
Giselle
Welcome to another episode of Conversations with G&G. Today we're excited to be joined by our special co-host, Danni Synot, as she dives into the important topic of stress management sharing practical strategies to help manage and prevent anxiety. Thank you for being here, Danni, and welcome to the show.
Danni
Great to be with you. Sounds funny, doesn't it? Welcome to the show. Yeah, it's different being on the other end of the presenting, I guess, and yeah,
Giovanni
Yeah, but you're such an expert on this topic and such an important one to go deeper and, and unpack it all.
Danni
Yeah. That's right. Well, stress is something that affects everybody. Of course. You know, none of us are immune from stress. And what people don't realise sometimes is, there are actually two different types of stress.
There's, you know, stress that, you know, we're very familiar with that stresses us out. And it's awful. And we get, you know, symptoms where maybe our heart's racing a little bit and we feel sick in the tummy. But there's also what's called ‘you stress’, which is more of a positive type of stress. So it might be that you're about to give a presentation and you're super excited, but you're nervous, you know, and you're maybe, you know, you maybe you've got a few things going through your head like, oh, you know what if this happens, what if that happens? But you know, you're generally positive about it and it's motivating you towards your goal and towards what you're trying to do.
Unfortunately, when it gets to a point of affecting us in a negative way, particularly over a longer period of time, like, say, it's lasting more than, say, 2 to 4 weeks, then it's something to really be aware of, because it can very quickly then turn into anxiety, which is a whole other level.
So what you want to say in life is understanding what do you feel when you're stressed, and what's the difference in that feeling when it's ‘you stress’, opposed to transitioning into a more negative, destructive type of stress for you. And we all have different symptoms around that. Like for some people it is like the palpitations or sweaty palms or feeling of butterflies in our tummy.
For other people, you know, they literally will run to a bathroom and spew. So it's just getting to know, you know, what your body is and even what your triggers are to, you know, is it something that is an emotional trigger or a trauma maybe from your past, you know, and we see that a lot in conditions like post-traumatic stress disorder, you know, returned soldiers, for example. You know, they'll have a car backfire and all of a sudden it triggers them into, you know, a major trauma incident where they're having flashbacks and things like that. And so just being aware of what those triggers are, what those feelings are, that coming in so that as they're happening, you can identify them and just diffuse them a little bit.
Giovanni
Yeah, absolutely. And you would have life experience but also a formal qualification in the field. Can you tell us a little bit about your background Danni, as a refresher.
Danni
So yeah I'm a qualified counselor. So as a profession, you know, I certainly deal with a lot of people dealing with anxiety and burnout and stress in their lives, and I've run seminars on it before and spoken on it a lot.
As well as that, I have a coaching element of things that I do, too. So, currently in the process of writing a coaching program on it as well. So looking very much forward to that, because it's something that a lot of leaders deal with as well. And something that's so preventable. And of course prevention is better than cure. If we can get ahead of it you know, that's great. And, you know, I guess, speaking to the converted when I say that, because I have had a very long battle over a number of years with anxiety disorder to the point that, I was having panic attacks constantly. Couldn't eat or drop down to like 49 kilos? I've had that situation a few times in my life.
One was a greif experience when I lost my baby and it threw me into that. And so that can sometimes be a trigger for anxiety, too, is trauma. Other times it's been when I've been working too much and not watching my life balance. And then the third instance was when I was diagnosed, actually with a heart condition that had underlined some of that as well.
And I had to have a procedure called an ablation to be able to, to deal with that side of it. And so, you know, having that journey, having to, you know, get to those places where I couldn't leave the house, I couldn't work, I couldn't drive the car. I know what it's like to live in debilitating stress and anxiety and trauma and and, have it be, you know, just life stopping, actually.
But that's the hope, isn't it? Here I am today, being able to talk about it and help others through it and have not had any anxiety. Now for, you know, probably 2 or 3 years. Yeah. Because of learning all about it, learning the things that we need to do to not just prevent, but also to manage or to come back from.
And so, yeah, I think I'm really blessed to be in that unique position to not only have the head knowledge and the qualifications around it, but also that personal experience. And, you know, as a hope for others that, you know, you don't have to stay in that place and it is possible to get your strength back to come back and then, you know, even help others are wonderful.
Giselle
So anxiety and stress, what's the difference between them? And they're obviously linked.
Danni
Yeah.
Giselle
In some instances as well. So how would you define or differentiate them?
Danni
Yeah, absolutely. Well I think with anxiety there's always stress present because that's what it leads to. Anxiety really is more when it's affecting your life to a place where you can't live it normally.
Okay. So when it's stopping you from living everyday life, when it's affecting your ability to work or think or be in a relationship, all of those things constitute more of an anxiety. And typically, it would involve things like panic attacks. And so if you've ever experienced a panic attack, you know how scary it can be. You literally can feel like you're dying.
Typically heart racing, you know, palms sweating, not able to think. And typically when people are in an anxiety state, they fit into one of four categories. So, fight, fight or flight, freeze or fawn is the other one that we don't hear about so often. So freezing is where you just basically frozen, you know, you can't think, you can't sometimes move.
You just get into that state of just being sort of solidified in your state. Can't focus. Flight. You get that urge to run, to just get out of wherever you are. So it might be that you're in, say, for example, a crowded room and you just feel like I have to get out of here. I can't, you know, I can't cope or I can't escape. And so you'll just flee. Then there's, fight. So some people will actually get quite aggressive in their language or in their body language. They might argue back, and it's not coming from a space, actually, of aggression. It's fear and the need to sort of fight their way out because they're feeling so threatened.
Fawning is a little bit more along the lines of people pleasing and basically submitting to whatever they feel the threat is. And so then their own needs and boundaries just go out the window and they end up living life to other people's expectations, but never able to rest or feel safe in their own skin and in their own space. And that's one that's a little bit more under the radar. And often they're the people, the carers, the people that are always doing something for someone else, living up to everyone else's expectations and their needs never end up getting mad. They're always pouring out and never being poured into. And usually they're people that won't ask for help either, or accept it if it's given.
Giovanni
So it's recognising those signs that they even you, you might be experiencing a panic attack because your, response to it is within those four categories.
Danni
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's you know it can be really horrific. Like I remember when I was at my worst, I could not even leave the house, you know, I couldn't eat, I couldn't swallow, I just felt like I was going to choke all the time. It was awful. It was just really awful. And then, of course, socially, I wasn't connecting because I wasn't getting out of the house.
I didn't feel like being around people, and yet I was petrified of being on my own because I just felt like I was going to die. Something was going to happen. I needed someone to rescue me, and it was just a horrible time.
Giselle
How does one get to that stage? Like, are there things that you can do to recognise early to sort of prevent it from getting to that point?
Danni
Yes and no. I think it really depends on your circumstances. For me, because I had had such an unexpected shock and sudden grief experience, I didn't have time to do that. And I think for me, I had never had somebody super close to me die, let alone a child. And so that whole concept of death just was very consuming for me and trying to make sense of it.
All of a sudden, I guess dealing with the thought of mortality and, you know, if it can happen to my son and I can't control it, it was that real sense. And that's really essentially what anxiety is. It's that feeling of being out of control or not having control.
Giovanni
Yeah. It's one of the basic needs for human beings, right? Having, you know, it's a need.
Danni
Yeah. And yet there are certain things that we actually just need to surrender, you know, whether that be, in my case, as a Christian, to, to God, or in a higher power, but also just admitting, you know what you can and can't control. Like there's a fantastic book that's out, and just been released recently by Mel Robbins called the Let Them Theory, talking about, you know, letting people do what they need to do.
And then the second part of that is let me, which means to then take responsibility for what I can do, what is my responsibility and how I'm choosing to respond to what I can't control. And so all of those concepts are super important in stress management. And, you know, anxiety. Yeah. And, you know, it's when you're at that rock bottom that when you're in that cycle that it can be really difficult because what often happens is when somebody gets to that place where they're in an anxiety cycle because of the thoughts that you have at that time. And often the biggest preventer, if you're wanting to get ahead of it, is when you start to have those ‘what if feelings’, you know, what if someone dies? What if I don't get the promotion? What if, you know?
Giovanni
You automatically start to think about the negative outcomes. Yeah. Right.
Danni
Yeah. And we never switch that to. So what? Yeah. You know.
Giselle
Giovanni
Yeah. True.
Danni
You know, or thinking it through. Well, so what if the promotion doesn't happen?
Giovanni
You know, what's the worst possible outcome for can happen? And then once you maybe write it down, you realize that, well, it's not so bad. You know, that day.
Danni
Yeah.
Giovanni
You can get on with it.
Danni
That's it. And about flipping the script. So what do you think the negative would be? You know what if I didn't get the promotion or what if I get, you know, made redundant or whatever the situation is. When you flip that to a “so what?” and then a “but what if?” that leads to your dream job? What if, that then means that you can go back and study what you, you know, like, so it's all about that's all about mindset.
Giselle
So don't focus on just the negative.
Danni
Yes that's right. And then you have situations like when I lost a baby. Well I couldn't bring him back. I couldn't control it, I couldn't do that. And then I found myself in that space because at that point I didn't have the mentoring or the skills or even the level, like, I guess in my faith journey to, to deal with that.
And so I end up having some psychology and what the psychologist had shared with me, you know, around a number of things. But one thing that was really valuable around the agoraphobia that I was experiencing, not being able to leave the house, or drive the car or go to work. Was it explained that life was like, the whole world being in a box.
And that if you, you know, have a situation where something happens and you have a panic attack like it may be, you're driving the car and you have a panic attack. So then all of a sudden you stop driving the car so your world gets a little smaller. And then, you know, you step outside and you get stung by a bee, and so then you no longer go outside. And so then your world gets a little bit smaller because you are confined to the house. And then something happens in this tiny room, you know, vice versa. And your world just gets smaller. And it's like the boxes, you know, bit like those Russian dolls, and you've got a doll inside of a doll inside of it, and it gets smaller and smaller, and then it gets smaller and smaller.
Giovanni
You completely stuck.
Danni
Yeah, absolutely. And so how do you get out? Well, you've got to push the boxes back out. And the reality is it's a little bit like you guys have got little kids. You might have heard of the, book going on a bear hunt, going on a bear hunt, going to catch a big one. Can't go over it. Can't go under it. Got to go through it. Yeah. And so and a very well-known author, Chris Fullerton put it this way. And he said, “you cannot conquer what you refuse to confront”. And so, you know, you do. You have to go through it. You have to confront it. You have to be brave enough to do that.
And just the little steps, just the baby steps in pushing the way out. And I remember specifically for me being in bed and not being able to get out of bed, and my whole three goals for the day were to get out of bed, take a shower and eat something, and then I added another one, which was to go and get the lettuce out of the letterbox.
Now how ridiculous does that sound for an everyday person? But that's how severe it had become. Yeah, and then eventually I could walk with my husband to the end of the street, and then I could go around the block and I, you know, slowly, just that slowly, gently some days where I felt like I couldn't. Yeah. You know, and, you know, a whole process around that.
But what happens is when your nervous system is so sensitized, you've not only got those thoughts going on, but those thoughts are a chemical process in your brain. And so, by changing your thoughts you can actually change the way your body responds. Because when you're stressed, all of the thought processes in the brain activities in the middle of the brain.
But when you're thinking and your rational you're making decisions. The activity goes to the frontal lobe in your brain. And so in effect you can't be for example thinking and problem solving and or you know, if you have that faith, you know, worshiping and fearing at the same time.
Giovanni
Yeah, you can only hold one thought at a time.
Danni
Yeah. So if you can keep yourself, you know what we know in common terms is in a meditative state or in a thinking state. You know, you're keeping the thoughts that you can sort of combat that and so because of that, those chemical reactions, like adrenaline, you know, that we heard about, we know that the cortisol and everything that happens with our bodies, which make our heart start to beat faster when we're afraid, which causes us to, you know, sweat or to have that feeling of needing to run our bodies, getting to that cycle.
So when we're in a cycle where we get those physical symptoms, what can then happen is we could calm as a cucumber sitting there watching TV. And then we might have, you know, our heart, just do a little jump or we might have, you know, the room might start to get a bit hot and we start to sweat.
But because those are the same physical symptoms that we've had when we've had an anxiety attack, even just those physical sights or feelings or sounds can actually trigger the anxiety rather than the thought actually triggering it or the situation triggering it. And we end up in this cycle, or we stop eating, you know, because we're feeling tight in the throat or whatever. Or we are grieving and so we've, we've lost our appetite. But then if you don't eat what happens? Well your blood sugar drops and your blood pressure drops, and then you start feeling shaky, which then giveS you the same symptoms. So you just getting this vicious cycle so often and so things like making sure you're getting enough sleep, you know if you can't eat, just eat something.
You know, I found at one point if I had a couple of diets, you know, highly nutritious, a bit of sugar first thing in the morning, it would be enough to get the salivary glands going, which would then trigger my need for hunger because I've only eating a little bit. But I'd get that quick burst of sugar with some vitamins and minerals in it to be able to then continue to eat.
Or I'd go for something like yogurt that was easy to swallow, or a smoothie or something that I could just sip. And with soup.
Giovanni
You could take that small step and then hopefully from there, you can get unstuck, really.
Danni
Yeah, that’s it. And choosing those foods that are nutritious, making sure if I can’t eat, well go get some sustagen and drink that instead of a coffee.
Giselle
Yeah.
Dannin
Stay away from things that are going to heighten your state of stress. Stay away from the caffeine.
Giselle
Yeah, more herbal teas, warming. Yeah.
Danni
That’s right.
Giovanni
What you mentioned before as well. Seeking for help. Right. Speak up.
Danni
Oh exactly.
Giovanni
Reach out. Yes. So critical. Right.
Danni
See a therapist, don't isolate, make sure you've got the right people around you.
Giselle
And I think what you were saying before about the small goals, I think that's important because they need to be achievable. There's no point putting something in place that you're not going to get there and it's going to be too hard. So something small, like going to collect the mail every day or yeah, you know, going outside three times a day.
Danni
Yeah.
Giovanni
Then you want to feel like that momentum, you know, a successful cycle, hopefully, upwards.
Danni
Yeah.
Giovanni
Starting small goals and then you build it up from there.
Danni
Yep. That's right. And you know if you're in a really like full on state of anxiety or burnout, you know, when you just need to have the energy to, to do anything, you know, sometimes Gio those bigger goals and that meaning and purpose becomes like there's nothing on the horizon because you can't even you're in survival mode, literally.
Like you can't see the big vision or the purpose, or you feel like your life's over and you're never going to get it back, which is such a lie, you know? But, you know, it can be that way.
Giovanni
Yeah you can kind of loose track of.
Danni
But allowing yourself to, actually, have some joy is super important. And one of the first things I'll ask a client when I'm in a session is, what do you do to have fun?
And do you know what most people, they're on the spot and I can't even think about it because they're too busy. They're too stressed. They’re too whatever. And that's the first sign to me that they're in you know, they're in trouble. Because if you're not doing stuff for yourself and you've got no sense of joy, you're certainly not going to have purpose or dreams or vision.
It's such a key. You know, there's a very famous Bible verse that says the joy of the Lord is our strength. So if you don't have joy, you know, you can just about guarantee that your strength, mentally, physically, emotionally is being compromised. That's really important. And, you know, simple ways to get that back to, you know, it's garbage in, garbage out.
I mean, what kind of music you're listening to is that depressive doof-doof stuff? And, you know, what are you watching on TV, sitting there watching murder and, you know, all that tough stuff. And now I'm not saying, you know, I'm not telling people what to watch or not watch, but what I'm saying is what your five senses touch, taste, smell, you know, what are you hearing?
That's your body's,
Giovanni
Absorbing all that energy
Danni
It's straight into your nervous system. Like, literally straight into your nervous system. So if you're out in nature and you're going sitting by the beach, or you've got calming music on or you're
Giovanni
All of a sudden it makes you feel much better.
Danni
Yeah. check a comedy on. You know, you get on and watch some funny stuff and send it to other people and get set aside to yourself.
Yeah, like even if you're feeling like that, what's something positive that you can do for somebody else that's struggling? You know, can you send them some flowers? Do you just send a note of appreciation to someone, or do you check in with them and see how their day's doing? Because then you've got some meaning and purpose, even if it's small, you know, you're making a positive impact and a positive difference, even if your own world is not there at the moment. There's so many ways, you know, what are some of the dreams that you buried and never fulfilled that you'd still love to do?
What's your bucket list? Make a list of ten things that you would love to do in your life.
Giovanni
So those strategies to help you, you know, get unstuck literally. Right. Just turn that trigger to just shake it up and see if you can have a little bit of hope and something to look forward to.
Danni
Yeah.
Giovanni
And then you build it up.
Danni
Sleep, Gio and rest. Huge. You know, most people that are depressed are night owls because the serotonin production is best between about eight and midnight, every night. And so those people that don't go to bed till midnight, they're missing, that they're sleeping the day away. Their circadian rhythm is out. Yeah. You know, just checking even, with the doctor, making sure you don't like I did and, you know, had misdiagnosed for many, many years.
You know, I had a heart condition where there's an electrical issue with my heart that was fixed with an operation. That was a day procedure. Yeah. You know, like.
Giovanni
So easy.
Danni
You know, so quick, so easy. No medication. I didn't have to worry, but there was like, Yeah, there's other things, I guess involved in that too, of looking at, you know, are you low in vitamin D?
Because vitamin D is a precursor to serotonin, which is, the good chemical of your brain that helps you to feel happy, but it also helps the synapses in your brain to send messages to one another to help you to, you know, think more clearly to get your rest. Yet to do all of those things.
Giselle
Yeah.
Giovanni
You know, many strategies.
Giselle
And we've had Doctor Dhanya on a few times and she's, she's talked about diet and the gut and then how that helps with mood and how that's all linked as well. So things like eating seasonally, you know, making sure you digest properly and chew and all those types of things as well. So that's probably another good episode to watch, because that also can help make sure that people are on the right track.
And if they are, you know, fine, getting anxiety or other issues, sometimes those little things can help.
Danni
Yeah, exactly. And I think going to your doctor is a really great one, because if you're in that situation where you're very stressed or you're anxious, you know, that can eventually lead to cardiovascular events like, you know, heart attacks, cancer and all of those things.
Giselle
So the long term consequences
Danni
Yeah and sometimes it's easy, as easy as dealing with, you know, a deficiency in your body like iron or vitamin D. Sometimes it might be that you're a bit pre-diabetic, you know, are you exercising? So I would say there's even lifestyle things you need to be making sure you're taking care of when you're stressed.
Like, yes, the laughter and the fun and the connection. Super important. Don't isolate. But are you getting enough sunshine and fresh air and exercise? Well, you can go for a walk and take care of all three. And you only need to do that for 20 minutes a day.
Giselle
Exactly.
Danni
You know, go sit out in the sun. Yeah,
Giovanni
Your GP is such an important source of information. And I guess where it all starts, really. And it's something that I learned recently I haven't thought of that. Make sure you book a double appointment when you go see your GP.
Danni
Yep.
Giovanni
Double appointments. So you really get a time to just sit down and explore all the possible avenues to get you back on track.
Danni
Yeah, exactly.
Giovanni
Single appointments go so quick. And then they might not have time to go deeper and really understand, you know the root cause of anxiety or whatever the issue you're facing.
Danni
Yeah. And that's a really good point Gio. That's something that I found too when I went to my doctor, we booked a double appointment and I had a mental health assessment because you can get your ten free appointments with the psychologist.
Which is great and a good step to be able to do, unfortunately, in my experience. So what happened with that was because I didn't know better at the time and to go further and because of their own constraints is typically that will do that. And that's great because your getting into a psychologist and you can have those conversations.
And if you're needing medication and some people do nothing wrong with that at all, that can be a helpful step too. But if you're not actually dealing with the problem, your just dealing with the emotional side of it. You're dealing with the physical symptoms with medication. But if you're still staying up all night, you are still eating rubbish. You still, you know, not exercising and you're not supporting your body to deal with that stress. If you're not doing conscious acts towards meaning and purpose and you're not doing that holistic stuff, then those things are not going to get you very far at all. You know, it's.
Giovanni
It really is a complex issue.
Danni
That has to be holistic.
Giovanni
Properly. Holistically.
Danni
Absolutely.
Giselle
Yeah. And the person needs to have ownership and want to improve that. They can't just expect quick fixes with other things. It needs to be within them too.
Giovanni
100%. Understanding that ultimately you are responsible right.
Giselle
You are responsible for your health.
Giovanni
Implementing the plan.
Danni
Absolutely. And you have to want to
Giselle
Yeah.
Danni
You know, and it is hard work. And you know, you get into that space a lot quicker than you get out of it. But you can then if you want to, you will. And with the right support around you. I think the other thing with that is to remembering that the health care professional, whether it be a doctor or a psychologist or a counselor, can only work with the information that you give them and the effort that you put in.
Giovanni
That's right.
Danni
So something I'll often say to clients is, I don't have a magic wand. You know, I'm saying I can't just fix it for you. I can, help you to find tools. I can be here to listen. I can help you, you know, a coaching space, you know, work out a strategy and do all of those things.
But unless you're willing to put in the work and you're willing to do that, and I'm actually now at a point where I will refer someone on, in a counseling situation, or if I'm coaching, you know, I will even end the relationship if a client's not contributing.
Giselle
Yeah
Giovanni
Not putting in the work.
Danni
Yeah. And then there are other situations too, like if someone has a mental health condition or there's something more going on that is, you know, not in my scope of qualification, then I have a responsibility to either completely refer somebody on or to work alongside those other professionals as part of a team, but you've got to be part of your team.
Giselle
Yeah. You’ve got to be the leader of the team really.
Danni
Yeah. Yeah.
Giovanni
Ultimately the captain of your own destiny. Right. So you gotta be able to, to drive that ship and, you know, and sail through.
Danni
Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Right.
Giselle
Yeah, absolutely. Any last tips and tricks or anything else that you wanted?
Giovanni
Just a quick summary.
Danni
Yeah. So I'd say you know if you're feeling stressed take notice of what you're feeling, how often it's occurring and if it's starting to interfere with daily life. Get some help. Go and see your GP, get a check over if you need to during that terrible appointment, you know, go and see a psychologist or or go see a counselor.
Take medication if you need to, and make sure that you take, really good care of yourself as far as your joy and your fun and getting to hobbies and doing all of those good things in the self-care, and really support yourself with good lifestyle, get enough to eat, get out in nature, do the exercise.
Make sure that you're looking after yourself in a holistic way and connecting with your higher power.
Giovanni
And watch the stuff that you take into your body. You know what you listen. What you watch. What you read.
Danni
Yeah.
Giovanni
Who you hang out with.
Danni
Yeah. All of it is super important.
Giselle
And another brilliant session. Danni, I love hearing about your experience and or your knowledge around the topic.
I think it's really valuable for all of the listeners here to get that. So thank you very much.
Danni
Well, I'm glad to have been of help. And, yeah, if you needing any support, please reach out.
Giovanni
Such a pleasure.
Danni
Thank you.
Giselle
Thank you.